FreeHovind - The Flood Continued.

The Flood Continued.

8 Comments - 1100 Views

Submitted By bigdog on 09/02/28

FreeHovind, bigdog, Discussions

The article also says, “Given the region's size, however, that's enough to add up to a vast amount of water.”
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/bigphotos/98306607.html

I’m not saying that’s enough to flood the whole earth, but if we just discovered this, then could there more somewhere in the earth?

Here are some great questions from answers in Genesis that question the local flood theory.
• If the Flood was local, why did Noah have to build an Ark? He could have walked to the other side of the mountains and missed it.
• If the Flood was local, why did God send the animals to the Ark so they would escape death? There would have been other animals to reproduce that kind if these particular ones had died.
• If the Flood was local, why was the Ark big enough to hold all kinds of land vertebrate animals that have ever existed? If only Mesopotamian animals were aboard, the Ark could have been much smaller.1
• If the Flood was local, why would birds have been sent on board? These could simply have winged across to a nearby mountain range.
• If the Flood was local, how could the waters rise to 15 cubits (8 meters) above the mountains (Genesis 7:20)? Water seeks its own level. It couldn’t rise to cover the local mountains while leaving the rest of the world untouched.2
• If the Flood was local, people who did not happen to be living in the vicinity would not be affected by it. They would have escaped God’s judgment on sin.3 If this happened, what did Christ mean when He likened the coming judgment of all men to the judgment of ‘all’ men (Matthew 24:37–39) in the days of Noah? A partial judgment in Noah’s day means a partial judgment to come.
• If the Flood was local, God would have repeatedly broken His promise never to send such a flood again.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v21/i3/flood.asp

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bigdog

4 days - 5,621v

Posted 2009/02/28 - 19:02 GMT

Also what if all the ice melted and all the water came up from the earth if there was more?

Here's an interesting claim from this website saying that there is enough known water to cover the earth.
http://www.conservapedia.com/Flood_geology

thebiblewascompiledin325AD

5 days - 8,032v

Posted 2009/02/28 - 22:08 GMT

...ok so you say it was a GLOBAL FLOOD. then i have some questions

1) where did all the water comefrom? we need a lot more then currently exist on earth to cover the mountains (yes i included ALL the water)

2) where did all the water go? since you would have to hide a lot of water.

3) why is the ground not sorted from densist particles to least densest?

as the "hovind experiment" clearly "proved"..

4) if it rained for 40 days HOW DID the sun generate enough evaporation to keep it raining.

5) the arc could never contain the amount of biomass that makes up all 2 of every vertibrate species on earth AND food and water for 40 days.

explanation plz.

6) what about crocodiles and amrine mammels..they are vertibrates yet the can easily live in water..WTF would they do inside the arc?

7) all that extra water adds heat to the earth, so wouldn't that NOT bring along an ice age?

8) mamoths frozen STANDING UP by floodwater? lol HOW? i'd say they where "swept away" to say the least.

9) you (insanely biased source) says that there is enough water to cover the eart...IF IT WAS LEVELED OUT!!

so where did all the mountians come from?

10) how can a "global flood" create a very "sharp" canyon in rock that is several HUNDREDS of metres above sea level? a flood would more likely just smooth eveything out rather thatn create such narrow passages.

and those are just a few of the questions which came up in me if you wanted to PROVE your SUSPICION. (as stated by others beofre me, the global flood "theory" lacks enough evidence to even be called a theory in the scienific sense)

so would you please answer them for me and other "evolutionists" as you like to call them?

rationalist (ben)

3 days - 3,596v

Posted 2009/02/28 - 22:41 GMT

The article also says, “Given the region's size, however, that's enough to add up to a vast amount of water.”
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/bigphotos/98306607.html

Again it is moisture in rock and not water. It is a good deal of water but not nearly enough.

I’m not saying that’s enough to flood the whole earth, but if we just discovered this, then could there more somewhere in the earth?

Sure there could be. But not enough. There are physical limits and all.

Here are some great questions from answers in Genesis that question the local flood theory.

Great because they are easily answered?

• If the Flood was local, why did Noah have to build an Ark? He could have walked to the other side of the mountains and missed it.

If would need to build it if he couldn't outrun the flood. Perhaps he lived along the banks of the Black Sea or in the valley that is now the Persian Gulf. Also what if God wanted to preserve the animals in that area, most animals do not migrate.

• If the Flood was local, why did God send the animals to the Ark so they would escape death? There would have been other animals to reproduce that kind if these particular ones had died.

That may have some validity if you can define kind.

• If the Flood was local, why was the Ark big enough to hold all kinds of land vertebrate animals that have ever existed? If only Mesopotamian animals were aboard, the Ark could have been much smaller.1

Actually it still isn't big enough for the period of time required (1 year) but it becomes more feasable. Besides you can't build a wooden ship that large but that is beside the point. AiG won't bother answering that one.

• If the Flood was local, why would birds have been sent on board? These could simply have winged across to a nearby mountain range.

Birds don't fly well in rain. Many can't fly at all. You would think that a place with Bible Dinosaurs would have a biologist on staff.

• If the Flood was local, how could the waters rise to 15 cubits (8 meters) above the mountains (Genesis 7:20)? Water seeks its own level. It couldn’t rise to cover the local mountains while leaving the rest of the world untouched.2

Well the word used is the same used elsewhere as hills so we don't know how high it had to go. Also it is forgetting the posibility that a natural earthen dam has broken. Just like what happened with the creation of the Persian Gulf and the growth of the Black Sea. I can splash water out of the tub without it running out of all sides.

• If the Flood was local, people who did not happen to be living in the vicinity would not be affected by it. They would have escaped God’s judgment on sin.3 If this happened, what did Christ mean when He likened the coming judgment of all men to the judgment of ‘all’ men (Matthew 24:37–39) in the days of Noah? A partial judgment in Noah’s day means a partial judgment to come.

That is presuming a worldwide distribution and since we reject science then why would we presume that? If all humans lived in the valley then there you go.

• If the Flood was local, God would have repeatedly broken His promise never to send such a flood again.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v21/i3/flood.asp

Since the Black Sea have we had another flood of that size? I am not aware of one but it could be.

This is fun but I know that there was no "Noah". It was just a retelling of the Sumarian legend with more embellishment that become physically impossible. There couldn't be that much rain. There couldn't have been that much water under the earth. There couldn't be that much water that disappeared. There couldn't be enough food and water for that many animals. There is no way to build a boat that size out of wood.

Look, everything in physics points against it. Just accept it for what it is, a good story.

bigdog

4 days - 5,621v

Posted 2009/03/01 - 6:37 GMT

(Dog) This is for Joe since these are good questions. I can tell you haven’t researched this for yourself from a creationist point of view. But I’ll try to answer some questions.

1) where did all the water comefrom? we need a lot more then currently exist on earth to cover the mountains (yes i included ALL the water)

(Dog) From the “fountains of the deep” and the firmament and some from the rain.

2) where did all the water go? since you would have to hide a lot of water.

(Dog) Back into the earth. Some of it stayed.

3) why is the ground not sorted from densist particles to least densest?

as the "hovind experiment" clearly "proved"..

(Dog) We don’t know exactly how the ground looked before the flood or even immediately after since it was thousands of years ago.

4) if it rained for 40 days HOW DID the sun generate enough evaporation to keep it raining.

(Dog) I’m not an expert but the water kept coming out of the earth, I believe for 150 days, so the the rain was being powered by the fountains and falling from the firmament. It’s probably raining somewhere in the world every day. Doesn’t it say in some text books that it rained for “millions of years” after the big bang? I saw that in one text book of evolution. Forty days of rain compared to millions of years? Now who’s theory looks ridiculous?

5) the arc could never contain the amount of biomass that makes up all 2 of every vertibrate species on earth AND food and water for 40 days. explanation plz.

(Dog) There weren’t as many species then. New species are forming all the time, but they come from their own kind of animal. Noah only took the different “kinds” of animals not all their species. They created new species after. That’s probably why we find so many fossils of unknown species.

6) what about crocodiles and amrine mammels..they are vertibrates yet the can easily live in water..WTF would they do inside the arc?

(Dog) I’m sure water animals stayed inside the water since there was plenty outside.

7) all that extra water adds heat to the earth, so wouldn't that NOT bring along an ice age?

(Dog) Now you’re thinking Joe! That is exactly what happened after. That’s where the ice age came from. Read in the Bible. There was no such thing as winter before the flood.

8) mamoths frozen STANDING UP by floodwater? lol HOW? i'd say they where "swept away" to say the least.

(Dog) Then why are they found standing up? They may have been swept away and then tried to stand up. See Hovind’s videos on the mammoths. Even the article I gave before says that they were found with tropical food in their stomachs undigested.

9) you (insanely biased source) says that there is enough water to cover the eart...IF IT WAS LEVELED OUT!! so where did all the mountians come from?

(Dog) Let’s not get into sanity here, because I question yours. The Bible says the mountains rose during the flood. They are still rising today.

10) how can a "global flood" create a very "sharp" canyon in rock that is several HUNDREDS of metres above sea level? a flood would more likely just smooth eveything out rather thatn create such narrow passages.

(Dog) I believe, but I may be wrong, but some creationists say that when the water receded it created the canyon. The first blast of water may have loosened it up. It also appears that there was a huge lake on one side of the canyon that overflowed over the mountain into the ground creating the canyon as well as the receding water.

(Joe) and those are just a few of the questions which came up in me if you wanted to PROVE your SUSPICION. (as stated by others beofre me, the global flood "theory" lacks enough evidence to even be called a theory in the scienific sense). so would you please answer them for me and other "evolutionists" as you like to call them?

thebiblewascompiledin325AD

5 days - 8,032v

Posted 2009/03/01 - 11:14 GMT

1) you give no answer other than "god didit". why? WHERE IS YOUR EVIDENCE THAT THERE WAS SO MUCH WATER BELOW THE EARTH.

2) ..again no evidence other than "it just happened".

3) your arguemtns actually discredits "hovinds" evidence, since we couldn't determine what exactly was laid down by a flood and what wasn't. srly learn to support your arguements.

4) w8 you actually say that an biology textbook spoke of it raining for "millions of years"...either that was a creationist text book or you must be talking about the earth 3-4 billion years ago when the earth was a lot more vocanicly active, and the heat generated rapidly evaporated water so it could rain again.

5)so w8...YOU ACTUALLY SUPPORT MACRO EVOLUTION?!

if you don't understand THAT question, you schould look up what speciezation is and what exactly qualifies as a "species".

6) w8 come to thin of it, the bible sais nothign about vertabrit animals, it sais

"Of all kinds of birds, of all kinds of beasts, and of all kinds of
creeping things, two of each shall come into the ark with you, to stay
alive."

and

"Of every clean animal, take with you seven pairs, a male and its mate;
and of the unclean animals, one pair, a male and its mate;"

so..explain yourself.

7) +8)RAIN AND WATER FROM THE EARTH GENERATED HEAT> SO IT' CAN'T FREEEZE.

oh and hovind's explination of ice comets is just laughable. i mean. is a bullet cold when you fire it from a gun? does the spaceshuttle cool when it reenters the atmosphere? No the HEAT UP.

9) right and exacly why are the mountians rising according to the bible? because volcanism on an early earth should explain some mountains, that is if you completely ignore platetechtonics.

10) ok if the water receaded in the canyon, then you should fina a large aquafier under the grandcanyon and passage ways inside the canyon for the water to poor down of. and have we found those yet? tell me if you have a scientific article that mentions that.

well you haven't given me any answers that are based on scientific proof, so that was false hope on my part.

btw here's a conundrum for you. if the bible is the infallable word of god, howcome it was written by 40 fallable human authors, completed by fallable roman priests in 325AD at Nicea and it was copied over hundreds of times by fallable human monks before the invention of the bookpress.

so exactly WHERE does that "the bible is the absolute truth" come from? when god didn't write it.

Kevin Lyon (physicist)

1 day - 1,877v

Posted 2009/03/01 - 15:35 GMT

But...but....if the story is not accurate, then how could all of the details of the story been true?.....You see....they weren't....you idiot.....I hate to stoop to ad homonym but this is by far and away the WORSE attempt at an argument I have ever witnessed…VenomfangX included. In fact, just for fun…let us dissect it:

• If the Flood was local, why did Noah have to build an Ark? He could have walked to the other side of the mountains and missed it.

Perhaps because this was not within his means…perhaps because he didn’t build an arc….there are soooooo many perhaps here. Perhaps it came without warning and he had only time to hop on a boat to save his bootie.

• If the Flood was local, why did God send the animals to the Ark so they would escape death? There would have been other animals to reproduce that kind if these particular ones had died.

It would seem that God did not send the animals to the ark…certainly not all of them…there would have been quite insufficient room to fit two of every “kind” on the arc. And it is evident, from the biodiversity we see today, that life did survive this flood in other parts of the world. Unless you believe that in the lost chapters Noah sailed the world distributing super-evolving species…er…kinds to their respective places.

I think we have already addressed this…the arc was not big enough to house every vertebrate animal that ever existed….sadly….we had to leave the unicorns behind.

• If the Flood was local, why would birds have been sent on board? These could simply have winged across to a nearby mountain range.

What would they have eaten?....who’s head would the poop on?

Why do they call them apple jacks…when they don’t taste like apples! DAMMIT THEY DO TASTE LIKE APPLES!!!!!

Why don’t you ask him for me?

• If the Flood was local, God would have repeatedly broken His promise never to send such a flood again.

Well we can’t have god breaking any promises…wouldn’t want him to come off like an asshole or anything.

So you’re entire argument is simply this….”If the flood story is not completely accurate, then how do you explain all of the details that presumably happened?” You must be joking…this hurts my noodle…OH sweet zombie Jesus the stupid it burns.

bigdog

4 days - 5,621v

Posted 2009/03/01 - 22:35 GMT

Thanks guys. You are very amusing.

thebiblewascompiledin325AD

5 days - 8,032v

Posted 2009/03/01 - 23:16 GMT

no thank you for making us laugh at the way the Biblical "global flood" is so clearly unsupported by science.

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